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 The Real Poison List

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mcdss
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PostSubject: The Real Poison List   Sun Nov 12 2006, 13:21

The Car

Honda Civic ES5M



The Mods

Intake:

1. Stock Airbox with High flow filter - K&N, Simota, Hurricane doesn't matter. (Second hand K&N filter, cleaned and oiled - $40. New $120)
Remove resonator.
Stick in a 2.5 inch aluminium flexi-tube the route the end to the front bumper area under the battery, no lower. This is a $10 mod.
Open a hole in the front bumper if you wish. it's a $70 job to open the hole and put in nice intake funnel.

2007 November updates: After such a long time, various options were tried out, you can use a closed power chamber (like the stock option, but a few hundred bux more for a cylinder style carbon fibre enclosure instead of the bulky stock resonance chamber and airbox). Original one is from BMC CDA. the rest all copies...

or the open pod configuration that does not lose low to mid end power so much ala the Blitz Sonic. Open Pod advantage lies in top end power. good if you always go for FULL THROTTLE everything... or track...



Header:

4-2-1/4-1 bigger header. brand doesn't matter. Hotbits, SD, etc. $200-$700 - your choice - NO difference to performance.

Cat: do not decat. if you need, change to a high flow. Address the sensor problem. stock cat also can. potentially, $0 ...

Exhaust: operate, or Remus universal $200-$250. Best to keep your stock box if getting Remus - up to $300 to get full bolt-on set so can just exchange when need to back to stock. Those wif money, legal mod to Supersprint $800 including licence/permit. Gains? 2 bhp.


Engine Mounts Inserts: Mugen Cost - less than $80

Update: Nov2007. Try on SuperPro Bushings for your car. They are not cheep, but they are very good. It links your car's running gear better than stock, and performs wonderfully, especially when driven very hard. the mod is not cheep... just under $1k... it's hard work to replace the 20+ pieces in the set... got to literally dismantle your steering gear and replace all the joint bushings one by one...

Strut bars: Engine Tower bar, Rear Tower Bar, lower struts front and rear. Brand - any light weight and least joints. e.g. Neuspeed... but it's ok for Alutec or even Silver's.


Last edited by on Mon Dec 03 2007, 11:32; edited 2 times in total
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Sun Nov 12 2006, 13:23

Suspension:

Tien SS for EP3. New or used ok. Can be fully rebuilt so it's a one time purchase. $1,000 up for used set (make sure the pillowmounts are not damaged - $2,000 for new set. Rebuild price is around SGD$200 per pair... not too bad...

- reasons for this set - the shocks are great. Height is adjustable so you can use higher setting for street/normal use, lower it for track use. further advantage - easy to sell when the time comes.


Alternative - D2. Harder springs, lesser shocks (this is opinions only pls) price is better than Tien SS, at $1,600 new, $1300 on special offer.... also fully rebuildable - as a one time purchase.


Full cambers please front and rear adjust to 1-3 degree negative or more depending on track driving style.


Wheels:

The lightest you can find for a good price, 15 inch. Rota comes to mind, cheep and good. Anything less than 6kg is light enough, after that you are splitting hair... The car is the ES Civic... not a S2000...


Tyres:

If intend to go track, Toyo R1R, Bridgestone RE01R, Yokohama AD07, or ST 215. or any comparable semislicks.


If just street racing - ST115, Eagle F1, Continental SS2, Michellin Sport Pilot Pecada2, Bridgestone Potenza G3, Revspec2, Perelli PZero, Perelli Dragon, Falken452, Toyo T1R etc. These can actually also go on track, but do watch the rubber after 3 laps, 6 laps.


Normal Driving - Falken 325, 512, Bridgestone RE88, Firehawk, BFGoodridge G-Force Sports, Michellin MXV, Perelli P600, Yoko DB, AVS, C-Drive, etc.
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Sun Nov 12 2006, 13:24

Brakes

STOCK. Change to 0-800 degrees pads in front, 0-500 degrees shoes at back. ($380 front brakes, $180 rear)

brake fluid - change to dot4/600. ($60)

clutch fluid - change to dot4/600 ($60)

Brake cables - Braided steel. (RS is cheep and good $250 - but need to check annually) (Goodridge is more expensive but front only, rear need to mod to fit drum brakes - $300 with lifetime guarantee... but still check la)


Engine oil

any double ester based fully synthetic oil will do... Motul V300 comes to mind around $40 per quart... so it's $160 per oil change... *phew!!!

Poyol Ester based oil is second choice - many out there, e.g. Redline, RevX. price I dunno. never tried...

Nov07 update: Tried... Redline 10W-30 street oil is actually light trackable. very very good.

Other 'fully synthetic oil' can oso la... just change every 5,000 km.

Nov07 update: Best price for brand? Royal Purple 10W-30. Under $60 per 4 quarts. (3.8 litres). Another very good cheep oil is elf Excelium 5W-40. Some suppliers going as low as $55 per 4 litre tub. Followed by Honda VTEC fully synthetic oil (by Indemitsu) also around $60 per 4 litre tub.

The silver Mobil1 in US Quart bottles also buyable around $60 for 4 quarts. I tried two oil changes on their 10w-30... very nice also.

Oil filter renew with every oil change. $8 from supplier, $12-$15 from workshop.


Spark plugs - Denso IK20L. Price $60-100 (depending on where you buy)can change every 15,000 km or less if you like...

I also tried 40,000km of Volker Racing Irridium... who say no good? Damn good la... but $100 for 4... rated at 160,000km vs Denso only rated to 80,000km... but we change every 20,000 to 30,000km... so there's really no issue is there?

Gearbox oil - original Honda spec oil will do, but change every 15,000 km or less... you will feel the difference. price? less than $30. You only need 2 bottles.

Update Nov07: It is highly recommended that you change your gear oil as frequently as your engine oil especially if you drive your car HARD at tracks... this is recommended by Spoon Engineers - good arguement - on track, it's your transmission that is more stressed than your engine... engine got rev cut, but your transmission is going at 100% tru all the gears... high stress neh.... I agree... Again, it's no issue as the gear oil change won't be too expensive if you use original Honda MTF or ATF.

Some are using Redline, but you got to watch the specs... only one type suitable for Honda ES gearbox...




If you can, lighten your car, and remove all lose items, or bag them so they dun fly around...


end result - super sleeper...


Last edited by on Mon Dec 03 2007, 11:44; edited 1 time in total
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mcdss
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Number of posts : 979
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Sun Nov 12 2006, 13:27

Update Nov 07 please see all the above posts... each area has a blue segment where updates were made.

also below here a few things not discussed above:

Suspensions

Stock is actually already more sporty than all the other makes, eg Nissan, Mitsubishi etc.

For better road handling, you can go for comfort/handling upgrade with aftermarket springs and shocks, the best of which is the Eibach Prokit springs with Bilstien shocks combination. Non height nor damping adjustable tho... but most comfortable with sports bias when needed.

Super Streets. This is what Tien names these suspension coilovers. For street sports application, these are reputedly the best in the market. Rebound damping and height adjustable. Also fully rebuidable locally tru ST if you bought from them. so it's a forever no need to change if you buy this set. just keep revalving and renewing oil. Those who want cheeper can get from Malaysia, N1Racing. But repairs/revalving need to send to KL. Local ST won't do it for you.

Other Good coilovers: Tanabe (only height adjustable. but very comfortable for occassional street sports); Hotbits (only height adjustable. the advantage for this brand is you can revalve it in JB. very convenient, and good price to revalve also. Can also adjust hardness by changing the springs.

German stuff... if you can afford these, K&W, Eibach, Bilstien all have coilovers for the ES. to repair them you need to send them to GERMANY... sorry lor... only if you can afford them, else ... you can't.


Engine Management Systems

haha... piggyback ECUs... these range from the simple (Apexi AFC NEO), to the super complex (Motec4).

Any of these, properly installed and tuned will give your ES an advantage over stock in a few areas depending on what the driver wants the car to do. It can be more fuel efficient, more power, or more power... hee... but do get the reputable installer for ES Civic. There are those very good with EG/EK but know nothing about ES.. can cause disasters. so do be warned.

Piggyback List:
Apexi VAFC2
Apexi AFC Neo
Orbit
Perfect Power SMT6
Destec Unichip Ver Q
Greddy eManage Blue
Greddy eManage Ultimate
HKS FConSZ


Monitoring Devices (Meters!!)
Ok this is not only nice looking, it is also vital if you want to keep your car for long term, esp if you go on track and make your ES do endurance runs...

Water and Oil Temp
You know your water temp meter on the dashboard won't move till you bust a fan belt... that will be too late... oil too.

Vaccum meter - there is a whole lot of things you need to know if you want to monitor your engine health - this is one of the most important instruments.

Oil Pressure meter - the older B series would NEED this as the VTEC is relying on oil pressure to activate the 'wild cams' a drop in oil pressure would mean the power is not going to come, and worse, may cause engine to overheat big time.

Volt meter - haha many laugh at this, but if your car's alternater fails, you will hot have power to run your aircon, ICE, ECU etc... properly! If your battery indicator lights up in your dashboard it usually is too late... best full throttle voltage is 14.0 volts... some even say 14.4v... how would you ever know this if you dun have a volt meter?

WAT brand to buy... got money, buy DEFI, or HKS, or Greddy, or Auto Meter (not autogauge hor autogauge is MIT brand... AutoMeter is USA brand). No money buy any MIT brand will do... most will work well... only how long the meters/sensors last, and how accurate... you just need an indication la bro... no need too accurate.



What you DO NOT need...


E68

Superione

Broquet

Electric Air Charger

Fuel Crackers

Vacuum Tubes


Last edited by on Mon Dec 03 2007, 13:32; edited 1 time in total
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Sun Nov 12 2006, 13:31

What won't make a difference in full throttle sprints


Cold Air Induction

Short Ram Induction

Cold Air Insulation

High flow/no cat


but these may help or hinder in everyday driving in the low-mid range rpms.
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Tue Nov 14 2006, 10:09

good reference bro.

heheh who's car is this? i think u quoting a combo of carts here rite Very Happy
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Tue Nov 14 2006, 20:30

dunno whose car.... but prolly I will go very near to this spec... demoding my front and rear lips and boot spoiler soon. very heavy... who wan to buy? cheep cheep... sell...

Laughing
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eeee78
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Wed Nov 15 2006, 08:42

mcdss wrote:
dunno whose car.... but prolly I will go very near to this spec... demoding my front and rear lips and boot spoiler soon. very heavy... who wan to buy? cheep cheep... sell...

Laughing
How cheap is cheap? lol!
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mcdss
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Number of posts : 979
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Ride: Honda Civic 2004 ES5(M)
Image!: Sleeper...
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Wed Nov 15 2006, 15:50

$250 ba. buyer pay for demod... front and rear lips.
$100 for the rear boot spoiler c/w brake light - buyer pay for demod. aimai?

ok got pic... but only to interested to buy people... ask for fun one dun have... but can come and take pic yourself Rolling Eyes
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eeee78
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 16 2006, 08:18

mcdss wrote:
$250 ba. buyer pay for demod... front and rear lips.
$100 for the rear boot spoiler c/w brake light - buyer pay for demod. aimai?

ok got pic... but only to interested to buy people... ask for fun one dun have... but can come and take pic yourself Rolling Eyes

**bish**
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 16 2006, 16:53

bro eeeeeeeee78

you **bish** me for the price, or for the pics part??

Shocked
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eeee78
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 16 2006, 18:12

mcdss wrote:
bro eeeeeeeee78

you **bish** me for the price, or for the pics part??

:shock:

Ur price is GOOD!!

U got the answer liao?
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Wed Nov 22 2006, 21:20

Latest - I have installed a set of 0-500 degree pads while waiting for the 800 stocks to come... finally off my stock pads... on stock rotors, and stock calipers...

haha... the brakes even when not yet fully seated in, BITES!

those not going track need not get 800 degree pads... 500 will do fine... can save some $$$ lor... hmmm save how much... few tens ba...


Long term report of the 800 degree pads' effect on the stock rotors coming up soon...


watch for it... hahaha will definitely try to take some pictures to illustrate.


Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Dec 07 2006, 23:54

shit.. i already decat..affraid affraid affraid
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Dec 08 2006, 02:20

you never go and validate your car at PG sprint nights... go and try with other ES ma... auto to auto, manual to manual... auto to manual also can... 1.6 vs 1.6, NA vs NA la...

den you will know where your mods stand... and how effective they are.

All the theories can den throw out the window leow...

if you TC, den pls sprint with the Colt Turbo... see whether yours can win or not... else why bother? or you taking on the WRX/EVO?

if you take on NA Civic, no need lor... win, expected...Loose???? how? sibeh boh bin eh leh.... den wat for TC??? hahaa... come come track and see how well your car wif all the mods do in 3 laps... or 6 laps...

den you can tell others what works leow... if you champion ontrack, no need to talk, everybody will want to pop your bonnet and do your mods...

come ... after spending so much to mod your car,... what a super big waste it's not tested on track... come to sepang... join other ES bros in trying out their own vehicles... no TP, no speed cameras... and no traffic lights hahaha... just lots of corners for you to play... and straights to drag...


come... come join in the REAL man's fun...


The Turtle - MCDS... my car btw, damn slow on track... hahahah but I go already... have you??
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Dec 08 2006, 23:55

pale pale pale
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mcdss
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Sun Dec 10 2006, 00:39

mai tu leow... just put down SGD$131, book a slot, and come to Sepang for a few rounds of fun. can really learn a lot from the free flowing corners, and straights...

no auntie style drivers to cuss at... all going at decent speeds... definitely fun.

come come... consider this open invitation leh... i'm very sure you will tia me one...becos I so slow... but I will be on track to let you tia...

you must lai!


Twisted Evil Laughing Shocked
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Wed Jan 03 2007, 18:50

mcdss wrote:
mai tu leow... just put down SGD$131, book a slot, and come to Sepang for a few rounds of fun. can really learn a lot from the free flowing corners, and straights...

no auntie style drivers to cuss at... all going at decent speeds... definitely fun.

come come... consider this open invitation leh... i'm very sure you will tia me one...becos I so slow... but I will be on track to let you tia...

you must lai!


Twisted Evil Laughing Shocked
pale affraid lol!
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Number of posts : 979
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 01 2007, 00:31

To the Track ES fratenity

Welcome to the Slow ES Track Cars hee hee hee...

Welcome the old birdies:

DaDude
Whitefangs
Roychew
George TwinX
Oliver fcuk
Darth Vader
hkspro
o0o
God
civic potenza


Newbies
fire88
macross43
rOcH
tatty bear


very very small group... very very fun times... all verified their car's mods, all verified their driving balls... haha

lai lai... more to join in? pls come and play... welcome all...
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 01 2007, 00:57

Just my thought , the top of the posion is to "mod" yourself to take up the challage and go to track 1st than only c what mod to do to ur car based on your feeling at the track.

U can mod all u want but if u don't test it , u never know how good it is.

Is me and my thought only
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Thu Nov 01 2007, 20:05

Go next wk lah Laughing
Wk day not many cars Cool
Hahaha... Whole PG only 4 cars Laughing Laughing Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Nov 02 2007, 03:29

No one to help also when required
Laughing Laughing Laughing
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Nov 02 2007, 11:33

rOcH wrote:
No one to help also when required
Laughing Laughing Laughing

True, good to have you by my side that day....THANKS Bro...

When my car started to spin.....i think you were more scared than me but after we get out to check, I'm much more scared affraid affraid affraid than you...hahaha. My car looked terrible Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad ...at that moment I thought it is not going back to sg with me.....

Once again thank you and Kelvin for helping me clear tons of stone at the pit...Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Nov 02 2007, 11:38

macross43 wrote:
Just my thought , the top of the posion is to "mod" yourself to take up the challage and go to track 1st than only c what mod to do to ur car based on your feeling at the track.

U can mod all u want but if u don't test it , u never know how good it is.

Is me and my thought only

First thing to mod before you go to track is your balls, remove it if possible....no more worries:affraid: affraid
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PostSubject: Re: The Real Poison List   Fri Nov 02 2007, 11:42

God wrote:
Go next wk lah Laughing
Wk day not many cars Cool
Hahaha... Whole PG only 4 cars Laughing Laughing Laughing

Not on rainly day cheers cheers cheers
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